Saturday, 14 December 2019

Why did we reject Evil Santa's presents?


Here's a short list of some of the stuff that the British electorate rejected in the 2019 General Election:
  • A 33% reduction in rail fares
  • A National Education Service and an end to rip-off tuition fees
  • The most ambitious environmental targets of all the major parties
  • An end to the systematic government abuse of sick and disabled people
  • £10 per hour minimum wage, and zero hours contracts banned
  • Reversal of the 67% Tory cut to the local government budget
  • Repayment of the pension money stolen from 1950s women
  • The rollout of free super-fast broadband
  • Re-investment in the NHS
  • Free dental checkups
So why did the British electorate reject all of this, in favour of an economy-tanking Tory administered Brexit shambles?

In my view there are two main reasons that British people decided that Corbyn was some kind of evil Santa offering impossible gifts: the bombardment of lies and the credibility gap.

The bombardment of lies

The research shows that 88% of the sponsored Conservative adverts injected into millions of people's Facebook feeds were demonstrable lies, mainly about the cost of Labour's policies and the absurd lie that everyone's tax bill would jump by £2,400, despite Labour's costed pledge not to increase Income Tax for anyone earning below £80,000.

Then on election day a fake "independent" Conservative front organisation launched a massive illegal propaganda campaign targeting polling stations in marginal constituencies across the country.

If you look at their illegally posted anti-Corbyn poster, you can see how much they were lying.

Apparently Evil Santa was threatening to "steal the children's inheritance", by, err, properly funding their education, freeing them from student debt, paying them £10 per hour, charging them 33% less for getting to work, building hundreds of thousands of affordable homes, and investing in high-tech, high-skill, high-pay industries.

Labour's policy was actually to maintain the inheritance tax threshold at £325,000, but scrap an additional property allowance, meaning the absolute maximum extra inheritance tax anyone would have had to have paid was £40,000, but only on inheritances of over £425,000.

Apparently this £40,000 paid only by the children of the property rich, was "stealing the children's future", but saving everyone who attends university from repaying rip-off inflation + 3% loans that most won't even pay off in their entire working lives, guaranteeing them all a decent wage whenever they leave school, and saving any of them who end up commuting to work fortunes on their rail tickets every year is unspeakably awful!

Then Evil Santa apparently wanted to "dictate their education", which is a total reversal of reality. The fact is that 75% of secondary schools in England have been privatised into the hands of unaccountable private operators, many of them major Tory party figures and donors, who get to control the curriculum, and dictate our children's education. Corbyn wanted to reverse this.

Point three is the terrorism smear-mongering which has dogged Evil Santa the entire time because he openly proposed talking to the Sinn Féin politicians before the Irish peace process and the Good Friday Agreement, at a time when Thatcher and her Tory government were secretly negotiating with the actual terrorists behind a wall of secrecy.

As Foreign Secretary Johnson sold weapons to the Saudi head-choppers, despite knowing that they were using them to commit war crimes, and despite knowing they were passing military hardware onto Al Qaida terrorist groups, but yeah, Corbyn is the terrorist-sympathiser and Johnson is the guy to protect us from terrorism!

The bit in the black box is also highly relevant. Corbyn is apparently the economic extremist for proposing public ownership of the railways, water supply, national grid, Royal Mail, and NHS.

Johnson and the Tories are the 'economic moderates' despite their demonstrable track record of outright defying the public will to privatise front line police services, swathes of the NHS, thousands of schools, prisons, the probation service, and conducting an enormous swindle to flog off the Royal Mail property portfolio at a tiny fraction of its true value.

It's impossible to deny that such a barrage of lies was an important factor in the election, especially the illegal postering campaign, ensuring the last thing that hundreds of thousands of people saw before they voted was a bombardment of lies.

The credibility gap

The Tories lied their way to victory, but Labour did themselves absolutely no favours at all with their election strategy.

I have no idea whose plan it was to launch a load of surprise policies like free broadband, the 33% rail fare reduction, and the repayment of the stolen WASPI money, but doing it as a sequence of surprise announcements was a terrible idea, because it made the party look incredibly irresponsible.

If you want to argue the case for increased public spending and more money in people's pockets, you need to lay the groundwork, you don't just dump it all on people as if it's a load of reckless pre-election bribes.

The majority of people in Britain simply have no idea at all about macroeconomics, because they've never been taught, and it's just not the kind of thing most people would choose to research for themselves.

If you want to switch from austerity extremism to investment economics, you need to develop a clear and simple economic case for doing so.

You need to come up with a few slogans along the lines of "invest now for a prosperous future", "you don't grow a business by cutting it, you invest, so why would you cut a country", or "more money in your pocket is more money in the economy", then you repeat it and repeat it and repeat it until everyone has heard it so many times they're bloody sick of it, but it's in their heads, so when you announce big public investments, or policies to put more money in people's pockets, they can link it to the slogans.

If you fail to do this, they link your pledges to ludicrous economic baby talk nonsense like "no such thing as magic money trees", or "how will they pay for it?", or "the money will run out" and then you're absolutely screwed.

The fact that millions upon millions of people still somehow think about the economy as if its a household budget, with a limited supply of money that can potentially "run out" is the origin of Labour's economic credibility gap, and their failure to establish any kind of simple counter-narrative absolutely did for them.

Announcing grand spending pledges as surprises just hammered nails into their own economic coffin, especially since they were as much surprises to their supporters and social media cheerleaders as they were to everyone else.

If "rail fares are too high in Britain" (which they are) and "for the sake of the environment and killer air pollution we need to encourage people onto public transport by making it cheaper than going by car"  had been a significant talking point for the previous year, then a surprise 33% reduction in rail fares could have gone down really well, but again the architecture simply wasn't put in place to explain why, so it just came across as a reckless pre-election bribe.

Labour's absolute failure to clearly explain the macroeconomic case for investment and increased public disposable income was a lamentable failure in basic planning.

It's irrelevant if you've got the better economic policies if you don't give ordinary people the basic architecture to understand why they're good for the economy.

It's a quite astonishing Labour Party failure that the Tories are still widely considered the party of economic credibility after the slowest economic recovery in centuries, the worst period of wage stagnation since records began, the worst productivity crisis the UK has ever suffered, the soaring trade deficit, losing Britain's AAA credit ratings, failing to eliminate the deficit after an entire decade when they said they'd do it in 5 years, and dragging the nation to the brink of a chaotic economy-tanking, job-destroying Brexit meltdown.

It was bad enough that Ed Miliband failed to capitalise on Tory economic incompetence in 2015, which was only halfway through this economy strangling austerity chaos, but the Labour Party has subsequently failed to win the economic argument twice more under Corbyn, and it's pretty damned obvious that if they don't start communicating investment economics to the masses fairly soon, they're in for another defeat at the next election too.

It's now stunningly obvious that people will not elect a party they can't trust on the economy, even if the alternative is deliberately steering the economy towards an unprecedented self-inflicted crisis!


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72 comments:

Michael Bond said...

Perhaps Labour deserved to lose.

They decided that chasing middle-class Remainers was more important than holding on to working-class Leavers.

Labour stopped taking ordinary people seriously. Its metropolitan, socially liberal, ”woke” ethos led to the unedifying spectacle of Labour MPs telling Brexit voters they had got it wrong through ignorance or racism, and must vote again,

It also led, most ironically (and even tragically), to Dennis Skinner. a Brexit-backing ex-miner, and a campaigner against the EU since its inception, losing his seat in Bolsover, which he had held since 1970…….https://mpbondblog.wordpress.com/2019/12/14/why-labour-deserved-to-lose/

Phil said...

Sadly simple people like simple phrases 'make America great' 'strong and stable' 'get Brexit done' because they can't be bothered to look any further than the pages of their right-wing rag or the drivel spouted on the right-wing British propaganda corporation. What better way to seize control than by divide and conquer and Brexit was the mechanism to do just that. Since the days of Thatcher, this it seems has been Tory policy. I won't be giving up my Labour party membership any time soon to sign up to the conservative cult.

Unknown said...

Unfortunately I would also include Jeremy Corbyn in the reason why labour failed. I like Corbyn I think his track record is excellent but the "IRA Loving Corbyn" narrative got through. when I asked people (and i live labour strongholds of Ogmore and work in Rhondda) they said they Couldn't vote for Corbyn no matter what he offered. A deltapoll that was carried out after the defeat asked "you said that you voted for labour before but are now uncertain. please say why that is?" 46% said they "don't like Jeremy Corbyn".

I think we need a change but we should not forget what Corbyn has started. we are truly a centre left party again and one which I am a member of (formally green but moved when the labour party returned to its roots). Im not sure who should take his place, i would have liked Laura Piddock but she unfortunately lost her seat.

Thank you

Unknown said...

The thing is it's not difficult to explain ... "if you move into a house that's been neglected for years you need to spend a bit more to bring it up to speed - or it will collapse around you and become a death-trap".

R. Kane said...

One of the problems with brexit was people did vote leave based on misinformation. We were misinformed on what it would do to the economy. We were also misinformed on the economic effects of immigration.
I don't think Labour explained this very well and no people don't like their ignorance and racism to be pointed out.
I however can't understand how people could repeatedly miss then point that Johnson's deal was terrible and negotiating a new one was the only sensible grown up thing to do.

paul said...

A couple of years ago I got into a long and protracted online spat, on a Labour FB page about Tommy Robinson supporters and UKIP ranging onto Leave voters.

To clarify, I am a Labour party member and I have been involved in left politics all my working life (35+ years). My argument was it wasn't enough to just dismiss TR/UKIP/Leave voters as beyond the pale and hopelessly wrong. For many it's a lack of hope about things changing in their favour, All many people have seen is an admittedly large increase in immigration (both white European and non-white) and they draw a conclusion. What we on the left were failing to do was to understand any of it. We just dismissed the racism as 'Jeremy Kyle types' or working class Tories or worse, fascists.
Many weren't these things but genuinely frustrated that rents are high and wages are low. They draw a parallel. Basic economics. A product is in demand so the price rises, is true of rent too. Workers come into a low skill economy and crash wages.
It is our failure to see that, or address it, or come up with a solution other than something intangible and remote like "build 1 million houses" ... that has led to today, where Labour lost to a party promising 'a points based immigration system'. 1 million new houses was answered by many on the doorstep with " ...what? Houses for immigrants built by more immigrants?"
It is the failure to see a fear of economic degradation over many years, in wages and rents and the degradation of any hope, that has led to people, working class people, choosing someone like Boris.
That there we all know people living on benefits and doing quite nicely. That's a hard one for many to believe but I know people who have lived their entire life on benefits and they live just fine, cos they don't have bills, but they're doing better than me. We didn't address that.

The Labour party didn't once say that we will prioritise our people for housing, it was a promise to build 1 million houses... but not who they were for. It's not a racist statement to make. Our people are people born here no matter what colour. We could have said they were for working people. You're born here and work and pay in and you go to the top of the list. We could have done that and undercut many arguments... and still housed people in need who weren't born here or were on benefits too.

But I got roundly condemned on that FB group some years ago for suggesting it. Yet I'm probably the most 'leftie' person I know. We just don't want to hear what makes people annoyed with some aspects of Labour, that we're perceived to prioritise benefits over work and 'foreigners' over those born here.

Hmmm.



Craig0 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Craig0 said...

Its only a week ago Labour activists were crowing about dominating social media during the election. And you were personally claiming Boris Johnson was going to lose his seat.

I understand that conspiracy largely funds your lifestyle, but it is not going to win you any elections. Far from being the saviour, you're one of the reasons Labour loses. Because the party will never fix its genuine problems as long as members are seeking solace in echo chambers and safe spaces that people like you profit from.

The truth is Labour lied just as much as the Tories during the election. That's just the nature of elections.

And if Tory activists actually are more vicious, abusive and harassing than Labour ones, I'll be very very surprised. Because the behaviour of Corbyn supporters, and support groups, online, constantly shocks me.

So drop this "we were cheated" stupidity. You lost a fair battle because the other candidate was much more popular

Anonymous said...

I have to say I completely agree with you here, I don't think it's so much Labour's policies that people had issues with, although I also agree with AAV's point regarding free broadband etc. The same thing I keep hearing when I speak to people is that they can't vote for Corbyn himself, and alot of people do mention the IRA. He did well to put up with all the abuse he had but, I felt like he never fought back. I think a complete change of leadership is needed with fresh faces to take things forward.

Martin said...

Yes, I agree with much of what Paul (14 December, 2019 13:37) wrote.
The left can argue (and I would) that immigrants contribute to the economy and pay their taxes, but this argument does not wash with a worker on zero hours struggling to find affordable housing, even though they fully accept its truth.
And a party's pledge to build, say, 200,000 units of social housing per year may not be attractive to a voter who's told net migration into the country is one third of a million every year, even if they trust the party to deliver.
There is a real issue with large-scale immigration into a country in which gross inequality exists. Remove the inequality then immigration becomes much more acceptable to the mass of the population (although there may still be a problem with overpopulation in parts of the country - it's palpable in the SE of England for many people. That zero hours worker may be a delivery driver whose working life is a nightmare of traffic congestion.) However, a real examination needs to be made of whether the Right (despite their paying lip-service to controls) uses immigration as a tool to maintain that inequality.

Craig0 said...

As for why Labour lost, I personally live in one of the ultra safe Labour seats in the north east that the Tories managed to win. And I will tell you exactly why Labour lost them:

1: The party has become middle class and London-centric to the point that you dont even understand who working class people are any more.

Corbyn supporters constantly portray working class people as poor, pathetic, down-on-their-luck, left wing types, who visit food banks and need constant support from the nhs and the government. That's your image of a low income person. As a victim.

But it's far from the truth. Actual working class people are proud,
aspirational, politically moderate grafters. Who want nothing more than the opportunity to work hard, and create an environment for their children that is richer than they grew up in.

You mock and attack the rich. When what working class people aspire to be. They want success in their lives.

So when you knock on doors, in Blyth or Sunderland or Bolton, and all you have to offer them is free wifi, and free tuition fees, and better free healthcare, and nationalised railways, it's patronising and almost insulting.

Do you even know who ridiculous it is to knock on working class doors, in Yorkshire or Lancashire and waffle on about the environment? Things that are important to you in London dont resonate in poorer communities. They frankly have a lot more to worry about than climate change.

In your head, you see Jeremy Corbyn as someone who appeals to working class people when it's the exact opposite- he's toxic to them.

You see him as a white knight who will ride in and save working class people, when they dont want to be saved.

You see Jeremy Corbyn as someone working class people aspire to be, when in truth, they laugh at him.

Working class people honestly aspire to be more like Boris Johnson, I absolutely promise you.

Because they're tough, ambitious people who see absolutely nothing wrong with success. They aspire to be successful themselves.

So next election, when you knock on their doors, offer them better training opportunities to get into careers. Offer them better schooling and and colleges for their children. Offer them better bus services, and infrastructure so they can get to work. Dont just show up with free wiki and expect them to be grateful to their London saviours

One of the first things Tony Blair did when he became prime minister was to start modern apprenticeships. He also expanded university places. He started tax credits. Because he understood who working class people are.

People who want opportunities to be more successful. Not people who want to stay as they are, and live off of the government

Anonymous said...

Unfortunately I think Labour will learn all the wrong lessons from this. Blairite will take over the party and it will become Tory-lite all over again. And they still wont win, but won't have Corbyn to blame.

Antitoria said...

Why did Britain reject Labour. There was a heady cocktail of reasons for this. Their leader was demonised continually and he's unpopular with so many different sets of people. It has been a dirty campaign and someone like Corbyn is not a mud slinger. Many canvassers came across the dislike even if the voter didn't know why they disliked him and many disliked Johnson also. Corbyn was proposing redistribution of wealth. Unfortunately there are millions of people in this country who have benefitted from high asset prices, rent and the fluctuations of markets that don't want distribution of wealth. These people are happy to have uneven government spending in their locale as opposed to others. The electorate has been conditioned to worsening conditions and therefore doesn't believe that these projects could be realised. Then of course there's the aging population to whom many of Labour's projects don't have any relevance. The elephant in the room of course was Brexit. This election was called the Brexit election and this issue overrode all others. Labour was proposing a renegotiated deal and a second referendum. Labour leave voters therefore voted Conservative in the absence of the withdrawn Brexit party, sacrificing the NHS, climate, wages, infrastructure and themselves in the process. Britain is now entering a dark phase in its history and there will be many casualties. I find the Conservatives very cunning and severely difficult to beat. They are a confusing moving target. There's Farage and his parties to enable Conservatism, the devious Liberal Democrats that can become centre or right wing. Look how Blair's era has enabled critcism (wrong) to be levelled at Labour. I am in fact surprised he even called it New Labour. To enable all sorts of regressive Conservative policy to be selectively labelled as left wing. The referendum and its consequences have worked out very nicely for the Conservatives whether it was deviousness on Cameron's part or not. So now we have another 5 years of their control to look forward to. How do we escape this madness ?

Hotlush said...

2/3rds of party members back remain so they should have ignored the majority of members to curry favour with the fair-weather supporters?
I think you've missed the point of the article; the policies weren't necessarily bad, or wrong, getting people to understand why they were right *and feasible* is where the failure lay.

SunnyD said...

I agree with you

Anonymous said...

The Labour leadership have showed a remarkable lack of basic pragmatism in the last few years.

Someone should have pointed out the reality that their choices were:

Get a different face at the head of the party

OR

Buy up a majority of the British media to hamstring the character assassinations on Corbyn

One of those things was possible but I fear that old Jezza hung on too tightly fearing a resurgence of Blairite worshipers are the altar of Reaganomics.

Gutted for you all in the UK.

lemonandhardy said...

Why does the idiot commenter Michael Bond assume anyone who voted remain is middle class, it fools like him who doesn't know his arse from his elbow that cost us the election, idiot

Unknown said...

I don't have the interest in a full reply but this is absolute bullshit of the highest order. Neoliberal propoganda, if you want left of centre vote lib dem or just vote Tory if that's what you want. The fact is the media and conservatives have spent 10+ years feeding this type of tripe to the working class and also the trope of the immigrant taking jobs, houses, overburdening the system, before that it was the working class "benefits scrounger" they blamed. They then instigated an EU referendum to regain seats they'd lost to ukip etc and settle internal power struggles. This then left labour led constituencies having to run local government on Tory agendas like austerity and no deal Brexit and thus taking the brunt of dissatisfaction because things have got worse in the last ten years due to a labour mp and immigration etc in folks minds in the towns, so they want out of the cause (e.u) so the "money given" to the emu can be invested in their town that so needs it . ... Because that's the lie they've been sold on social media and the MSM for so long.

Unknown said...

As Iam not registered to vote and proud not to get in the gutter with this lot,I feel sorry for the have nots who will be hammered into the ground and the clowns who voted for Boris hang your heads in shame just because he offered a Brexit bribe which he won't deliver you have stuffed it up for future generations who will be stuck in a neoliberal nightmare on steroids when they finish..you crazy Muppets the Tories are the problem not the solution.

Anonymous said...

[This is Mr. Magoo. I can't use my Google Plus account for some reason.]

Here are the reasons why Labour lost (in my humble opinion):

1. Sections of the MSM have convinced British workers to blame their problems (really created by capitalism) on the EU.

2. The smear campaign (Stalinism, a threat to national security, anti-semitism) launched by the whole of the MSM and the right-wing Labour MPs.

3. Remainers who voted for the Liberal Democrats, when voting Labour was the best way of getting a 'People's Vote.'

4. The 33% of the British electorate who didn't vote.

Anonymous said...

Labour Lost Because:

-They wanted to have another referendum and ignore the democratic mandate of the original.
-Their manifesto was an insane wish list of nationalisation attempts and undermining basic human rights like freedom of speech, property laws and workers rights.
-The Labour party had abandoned the working class in favour of immigrants and the middle class London intelligentsia.
-Labour further abandoned the working classes when repeated numbers of Labour strongholds allowed rape gangs to continue unabated for over a decade as reported in the independent report brought out earlier this year.
-Jeremy Corbyn and John Mcdonnell have a long history of supporting terrorist organisations and communist/Socialist despots i.e. Cuba, Venezuela, IRA etc.
-Labour are obsessed with anti imperialism. This manifested in the manifesto in the education section in which they wished to teach children how awful the UK was historically. You can't neg people to vote for you based on the culture they were born into.
-The Labour party are racist. The latest anti-semitism report if fairly damning, however they actively push forward race based quotas and had these in the manifesto as well. Race based quotas are racist, do not work and honestly: the UK is still majority white. They're unlikely to all vote for policies that are detrimental to their individual prosperity. Especially if they're based on race.
-John Mcdonnell is a communist and Shadow Chancellor.
-Diane Abbott is shadow Home Sec.
-Jeremy Corbyn went into the election with a lower rating then Trump in the UK.

Overall I'd say the Labour message was and still is: "You've been brainwashed, we're going to tell you what to think and make your lives all better. If you're white we won't help you as much. If you disagree you're a Tory troll and a racist."

Makes you glad capital punishment wasn't still legal if they'd won. Imagine all those people marching off to camps and their family didn't even realised they were racist until the state dictated it.

It's patronising, delusional and it resulted in this: The biggest upset to your authoritarian, state as father, anti free speech, anti human rights, anti British, despot supporting dreams.

People had a clear choice in this election: The Tories or Labour. We've lived through a decade of the Tories, we know how corrupt and useless they are. This isn't delusion. It's ordinary hard working people realising that the choice you offered: Was far worse.

The E.U are already offering a no tarrif trade deal.

Don't you ever think you can patronise us into voting for you again. Look at this and learn: It didn't work. Your politics, didn't work. The UK is not innately racist, it clearly and obviously wants out of the E.U now. Deal with it.

Merry Christmas.

Unknown said...

Best of luck remember 350 million on the side of a bus and best of luck with Tories and the terrorists Saudi regime head choppers..makes John Macdonald look like Harry crishner..you numpty.

stofcons said...

I agree with you that Corbyn is to blame, but NOT for the reasons you give. I believe Corbyn is to blame for being "too nice", not standing up to defend himself and his true supporters. In a sentence, Labour lost because the way it and Corbyn treated Chris Williamson and others like him.
You can NEVER appease those who are determined to destroy you. Labour and Corbyn did nothing but appease and appease and apologize and apologize ad infinitum. When the likes of Chris Williamson tried to stand up to those who were determined to destroy Corbyn and the Labour party that had returned to its roots, they ended up being destroyed themselves because of the weakness of Corbyn. Williamson was totally destroyed by the Labour party that he was willing to give his life to. And for what? For saying that the Labour party and Corbyn were apologising too much. And it was not just antisemitism or meeting the IRA. It was because he supported Palestinians. Here is your reason why a lot of Labour voters said they didn't like Corbyn. The forces aligned against him had made sure that his supporters turned against him. And they were amazingly successful.
Whoever takes over from Corbyn will have to stand firm and FIGHT, FIGHT and NOT APPEASE, APPEASE, APPEASE...

stofcons said...

"So next election, when you knock on their doors, offer them better training opportunities to get into careers. Offer them better schooling and and colleges for their children. Offer them better bus services, and infrastructure so they can get to work. Dont just show up with free wiki and expect them to be grateful to their London saviours" That is exactly what they were offered: better schools, free education, better public transport including improved and cheaper rail and bus travel, rid of zero hour, etc. etc.

Anonymous said...

@Unknown

250 billion to nationalise energy, 25-100 billion to nationalise broadband, 400 billion for a "Green Industrial Revolution".

350 million? Minuscule.

Saudia Arabia: Please God tell me how much you know about lobbyist groups in UK parliament and how to remove them? Do tell me your detailed plan? Is it socialism? It's socialism isn't it?

Corbyn. Is. Far. Worse.

Anonymous said...

@stofcons

No: Socialism and Remaining have been wholly rejected by UK voters. There's nothing any of you can do about it.

Anonymous said...

@stofcons

Corbyn never apologised for the way Labour councillors allowed rape to go on for a decade. Do you think he should double down there?

Bindoner said...

I think the decision not to "play the man" was a mistake at least as great as the failure to concentrate on the "9 wasted years". Johnson is such a degenerate liar it was a patriotic duty to campaign against his moral turpitude. Ironically all that taking the moral high ground has proved is that unilateral disarmament is a poor policy against amoral opponents.

Anonymous said...

@Bindoner

That's really interesting. Just to clarify; you think Labour loosing a historical number of seats was because they didn't employ enough personal attacks on Johnson?

Deep Thinking said...

"So why did the British electorate reject all of this, in favour of an economy-tanking Tory administered Brexit shambles?"

Because none of it was a promise to get Brexit done. While it's true the MSM over-exaggerated how complicated Labour's position was, it still wasn't as simple as it should have been i.e. "here's our deal for leaving the E.U.".

"It's impossible to deny that such a barrage of lies was an important factor in the election, especially the illegal postering campaign, ensuring the last thing that hundreds of thousands of people saw before they voted was a bombardment of lies."

I suspect most people had made their minds up by then.

"The truth is Labour lied just as much as the Tories during the election. That's just the nature of elections."

If anything, they didn't lie enough; people expect politicians to dissemble, which is why having a robust manifesto meant shit - everyone knows promises will be broken. The only promise that mattered was to leave.

Anonymous said...

[Mr. Magoo]

I agree with Stofcons. When asked why he hasn't done enough to combat anti-semitism in his party, JC should have replied: "There is no anti-semitism crisis in the Labour party. It was invented by the mainstream media to attack us for standing up for the Palestinians."

Neville said...

Labour lost simply because of ABC...
Anti-semitism
Brexit
Corbyn

That is all.

Anonymous said...

Pretending this was down to the media is laughable. Harold Wilson, Clement Attlee and Tony Blair had unfavourable press and still manage to achieve victory. It was even harder in their time given they did not have the Internet as a counter narrative, nor was there such widespread public distrust in mainstream media. Christ just looking over the pond and Donald Trump achieved an unlikely presidential victory with 50/52 mainstream media outlets supporting Hillary Clinton. A hostile media can be defeated, you just need a candidate who appeals to the majority of people's interests. Corbyn did not. He appeals to the metropolitan elite, virtue signallers and students.

Furthermore, all the media has done is report on things Corbyn has said and done. Did he support the IRA, yes, did he say Osama bin Ladin's death was a tragedy, yes, did he write a forward for an Anti-Semitic book that describes them as an odd and peculiar race, yes. Did he write glowing praise on twitter for The despot Fidel Castro, yes. He even came out with the gem of Al Bagdahti, a man running around with an AK-47 and strapped to a suicide vest, should have been arrested. I could go on and on and on.

These are actions taken by your man. These are things he personally did and should personally take responsibility for. They should be reported on. Tony Blair did not have this baggage. Corbyn did. It's understandable the average person considers him a threat to national security.

You also seem to have a stunning blindspot. Boris Johnson was castigated in the media throughout this entire election cycle. With Channel 4 and the BBC being anti-brexit and consistently anti-Boris because of this. With biased moderators in every debate and biased question Time audiences. The media not only gave credence to the Corbyn conspiracy theory with NHS/Trump, but they also spent an entire week hammering home how this blatant fake news was fact. You even had fridge gate with the Piers Morgan ambush. And the ambush with the child being treated on the floor. The media dug up every possible bit of dirt imaginable. There was even that week they spent trying to make him out to be a wife beater back during the leadership campaign. Throughout the campaign, there were consistent and determined efforts to paint one of the most socially liberal Conservatives as the coming of Hitler and the rise of Nazi Germany.

Yet, Boris, despite such smears and lies, cut through as he appealed to people's interests. Simultaneously marrying the desires of the working class with the wealthy. A working-class Corbyn and this iteration of labour will never understand.

Caratacus said...

Firstly, I didn't vote for Labour in this election; neither did I vote for the Tawdry Party, nor the popular local independent candidate, the Green ever-so-slightly-weird Party or the one issue nut-case on the fringe, and particularly not the Jo Swindle Illiberal Undemocratic Party. Secondly, I decided to scrawl "NOTA" (none of the above) forlornly across my voting slip, knowing as I did that it was a futile gesture - I just wanted to vote honestly for once in my life.

None of the candidates measured up to my exacting standards as a potential MP. Tory? Too many reasons to list here - lies, in hock to people who do not have our nation's best interests at heart, Universal Crapit etc.; Labour? The local candidate is a barely sentient fool without a single redeeming feature (although his mother probably still loves him), the list goes on.

All I wanted was a candidate who stuck to Jeremy Bentham's mandate, "Create all the happiness you are able to create: remove all the misery you are able to remove”. It really is as simple as that - and none of the political parties presented to us at this election came close. So I have decided to ignore the lot of them and spoil my ballot.

And now the Labour Party seems to be on the brink of appointing the ridiculous Kier bl**dy Starmer as the next leader ... oh FFS. The UK needs a sincere and credible alternative to the cynical and manipulative Tawdry Party, not a carry-on-as-you-are-everything-will-be-OK pretend opposition.

Rant over. Apologies.

Anonymous said...

To Craig who seems to think he's knows the working class so well.

What do you say to the working class Labour voters in Northern cities like Liverpool, Leeds, Manchester and Sheffield who stuck with labour in the hundreds of thousands and i include myself in this list.

The working class in these cities all know the same hardship, and have the same aspirations but we didn't decide to abandon the party and leave the country to the Tories and the worst character as a PM in British history.

If any working class person aspires to be like Boris Johnson then the UK is truly finished.

Anonymous said...

Hi Thomas

I'm growing increasingly concerned that a lie is being peddled by the Conservative Party, aided and abetted by the BBC through their inertia, to cover up its own infiltration by the far right following the collapse in support for UKIP. I also suspect that the 'former Labour voters' claim is largely a myth given the movement in numbers during this election. Just take a look at the differences in numbers of people voting for parties between 2017 and 2019:

Conservative +329,881
Labour -2,608,842
Liberal Democrat +1,324,562
SNP +264,804
Green +309,914
UKIP -571,251

Boris Johnson got barely more votes than May did whilst Labour appears to have lost most of their votes to the Liberal Democrats, SNP and Green Parties. UKIP will largely have gone to the Brexit Party but three things stand out to me:

1) The Tories haven't done much better than 2017;
2) The movement of their opponents numbers under FPTP has had the main impact;
3) It could well be former UKIP voters getting them over the line.

Blyth is worth a look too. The Conservative only got an extra 1,500 votes compared to 2017 which means at least 80% of the votes Labour were down in Blyth did not go blue. The Brexit Party did take votes from Labour (Ronnie Campbell was a Lexiter whereas the new candidate was not so this is understandable). However, it's a bit of a stretch to say lots of former Labour voters went blue here.

This matters because the BBC kept peddling a line that the Tories were appealing to Labour's 'Red Wall' through offers of more spending when in fact what could well have been happening on the ground could have been Tories pandering to the far right. Interestingly, the BBC were pushing a similar editorial line in 2017 until the Red Wall held on the night.

What is being covered up could be very disturbing. Dominic Grieve raised concerns about UKIP infiltration in Beaconsfield and suggested the problem was widespread elsewhere. Soubry was bullied out of Broxtowe.

This is where it gets really dark because who are these former UKIP members? An awful lot of UKIP voters and members have been polled in the past as having believed in all sorts of world government conspiracy theories which are of course deeply anti-Semitic. Farage of course is associated with both Alex Jones and Rick Wiles who peddle this nonsense. Other UKIP candidates in the past were known to use anti-Semitic tropes about connections between Marxism, Labour and the Rothschilds. And of course, if you look at these conspiracy theories, the EU is often prominent and the connections between antisemitism and support for Brexit are very strong.

My fear is that senior Tories are ignoring this infiltration because it is politically expedient to do so which means they are turning a blind eye to anti-Semitism. That alarms me because I think Labour's problem is part of a wider problem in society. 60% of people polled believe at least one conspiracy theory, many of them anti-Semitic. However, rather than defend the Jewish people, the Tories seem to want to brush this under the carpet except where it is politically expedient to make noise about it.

Thus in the last election, a decent man was smeared as an anti-Semite whilst the Tories harboured these people in order to get Brexit over the line. And to justify their increase in numbers, they claimed it was former Labour members instead. When of course we all know, there is nothing UKIP voters liked to say more than that they were betrayed by Labour (when in reality they were nasty Tory voting racists all along).

Anonymous said...

The data, from Factcheckers, is simple. 88% of Tory election statements and publications contained full or partial lies. The Lib Dems habitually lied about polling data to big up their own chances in marginals. They looked very hard for the equivalent from Labour, but although they found a few exaggerations, there were NO outright lies.

Anonymous said...

This analysis feels helpful, but doesn't go far enough. My believe is there are four prerequisites to a successful campaign. In no real order:

- Policies. They need to be clear, and costed, and explained. BUT, crucially, they need to be ruthlessly prioritised. That's what the Pledge Card did in the '90s. And what the Tory repetition of 'Get Brexit Done' did. Yes there were lots of good things in the manifesto, but it was hard for a non-expert to make sense of. On the doorstep, you couldn't explain it quickly and succinctly. Which is most important, and why? How is it communicated in advance and have we checked it aligns with what most voters want? Who is presenting it, and how well do they put such things across?

- Comms and Presentation. This is partly addressed in the piece above, but also includes a robust rapid rebuttal unit, schmoozing with parts of the media that you don't like, and telling the Leadership when they've got something wrong. Among many other things, the antisemitism row was a total failure of communications. The Comms team needed to be saying 'If Fred is responsible for overseeing this, delegated by the Leadership, they will need to get in front of the cameras to explain it, they will need to speak with individual members of the Board of Deputies and other sceptical voices, they will need to drive the process of assessment and possible expulsion through at pace and publish data every month. Leader, please tell them this is their only job.' They need to be able to tell the Leader when s/he has to make a decision. (They can be ignored, of course, but it will be expensive).

- Internal Party Management. This is NOT just making sure that like-minded people populate the NEC and are elected to the shadow cabinet. It isn't just making sure people don't rock the boat. And it isn't just 'listening' - it's showing in practical ways that all wings of the party can contribute. The leadership presided over major differences between the Blairites and Momentum and did nothing, that I could see, to try to bring them together. To be clear: The Blair/Brown government supported an American war, introduced (non-means-tested) tuition fees, and massively expanded the use of the hated PFI. BUT they also, to their credit, introduced the minimum wage, addressed waiting times and efficiency in the NHS, massively increased funding of our public services, introduced Sure Start, and beat the Tories in three elections. The energy, campaigning and commitment of Momentum - if unequally effective across the country - was at the same time too readily dismissed by the 'old guard'. This schism, which remains, was a deep failure of party management, and we lost many talented people - and Chuka Umanna - as a result. Party management also extends to Conference, which is a debate in front of the media, and needed far deeper thinking in advance.

- Closer ties to the electorate. Understanding from across the country what people's wants and needs are (they aren't the same) and embedding this in comms, policies and party management. After the results, I heard too many Labour candidates say that the leadership didn't speak a language, nor have priorities, that resonated with their voters. This covers all sorts of areas - but one example: How will the leader 'stand up to the world' - is s/he going to invest in our military, and reverse the cuts? How will they support our soldiers? There was a real opportunity to speak of cuts to the armed forces, aircraft carriers with no planes, proper support for veterans, and so forth. The Brexit policy is another example. Whatever it was, it needed to have been decided and explained and communicated clearly, properly and repeatedly a couple of years before it was. The appearance of dither was fatal, as it was so important to so many voters.

Anonymous said...

I have written, a number of times, on previous threads, that there would be a "reckoning"!

The "reckoning" has now happened!

The duplicity and mendacity of a party (Labour) to vote by huge majority to hold a referendum, to vote by a huge majority to pass Article 50, to fight the 2017 GE on a Brexit "ticket" and comment time after time that to referendum vote must be honoured .... and then have a front bench that, at best, could only then state their "neutrality", but with the majority stating that they would campaign for Remain in a second referendum, that they would arrange .... has been judged!


Anonymous said...

Seumas Milne, Corbyn’s chief strategist—and Labour’s policy maker, is a long term fan of the former Soviet Union and now Putin," Milne has attacked what he calls "the creeping historical revisionism that tries to equate Nazism and communism".[65] The victims of Nazism "in the distorted prism of the new history...are somehow lost from the equation. At the same time, the number of victims of Stalin's terror has been progressively inflated over recent years", he wrote in 2002" Wikipedia....he also relentlessly criticized European Union, condemning the “brutal authoritarianism” of its handling of the Greek debt crisis and blaming it and NATO for the “defensive” Russian annexation of Crimea. And you ask why Corbyn was rejected?

Karl Greenall said...

Labour made a number of elementary errors in their approach to the election, and until a serious analysis of where, when and what went wrong is done, then the past will be repeated.
One other thing - The Labour leadership should have been ruthless from the start in dealing with those sections of the PLP who were undermining it, and allowing lies and slurs to fester without rebuttal was fatal. Allowing loyal supporters to be thrown under the bus was unforgivable, but we must now move on.
It is no consolation, but we must not forget that Brexit will now play out, and if the hard Brexit that Boris really desires occurs, then all bets are off.
The fundamental incompetence in running things that his government represents should surely present some kind of dividend, especially if the Big One ( the anticipated financial crash that will dwarf 2007/8) arrives.

Anonymous said...

Karl Greenall 21.03

You wrote "Labour made a number of elementary errors in their approach to the election, and until a serious analysis of where, when and what went wrong is done, then the past will be repeated."

Let me help you out with some serious analysis....

1. Don't go into a GE with a policy designed to overturn the result of a referendum.
2. Don't allow your party to vote, by a huge majority to hold a referendum, vote to invoke Article 50, fight the previous GE on a Brexit ticket, promise to honour the result .... and then have you front bench spokespeople unanimously stating that they will endeavour to overturn that result.
3. Don't have a leader that isn't wanted by 70% of PLP and only wanted by Momentum nut jobs.
4. Don't have a Leader that demonstrates no patriotism for the country he aspires to "lead" and attends funerals of Terrorists that seek to harm the country that he aspires to lead.
5. Don't elect an unreformed marxist as leader of the party and don't appoint a Shadow Chancellor that considers it his "job" to "overthrow capitalism".
6. If you commission someone to investigate evidence of anti-semitism in your party, don't choose Shami Chakribarti - and don't promote her to The House of Lords for her report.

.... hope that helps (I might have saved the party a few bob eh?).

Anonymous said...

Labour worst result since 1935, Labour Scotland worst result since 1910 and Corbyn says he won the argument, what the fuck is he on ?

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Derek said...

Dear AAV ,
Unfortunately TIG was not more successful in persuading Labour PLP members to defect to them , as it appears that too many have remained to try and enact rebellion IV against what let’s call Corbynism , this time after their actions have managed to reduce the Labour vote from 2017 . I think somehow they envisage that Labour’s almost complete demise in Scotland , then by the NE of England and N Wales , and (especially if they get their way with the reinstatement of ‘Blairism’) , surely will be followed by subsequent further losses in Lancashire & Yorkshire . This could lead surprisingly quickly to the complete demise of the Labour Party , just like their sister social democrat parties in Europe .
Apart from toxic adherence to Remain , Blairites appear to have no policies , when the neo-Liberal chorus has bleated since 1979 and still shamelessly unremitting even since the logical failure of the ‘Debt Economy’ in 2008 . Since then growth has plateaued and the National Debt has doubled and comparisons with investment based economies such as China have become increasingly invidious . Personal abuse and propaganda are the chosen tools to reinforce the status quo , and maybe the final victory for British Fascism will be achieved by the splitting of the social democratic feelings of the Momentum young from the disillusioned Labour Party’s old ,
Derek

Anonymous said...

Derek 19.58

... and whilst numpties write rubbish like "the final victory for British Fascism will be achieved by the splitting of the social democratic feelings of the Momentum young from the disillusioned Labour Party’s old" ... then there is absolutely no hope for the Labour Party.

Ordinary folk like, and want, ordinary things. Patriotism, self governance, the ability to elect, and eject, our law makers, are the ordinary stuff of democracy. And yet Derek interprets this as "British Fascism".

Derek is still clueless. Derek demonstrates he has learned nothing. He watches the vox pops of voters in Blythe Valley and Darlington and Workingtone, et al, telling reporters why they voted Tory - and Derek's conclusion is that it is because they are fascists!

Whilst Derek, and people who think like him, seek to portray ordinary folk wanting ordinary things ... as fascism, then there simply is no hope for him. He will continue to be a marginalised, left wing nutter that simply cannot comprehend the views and values of ordinary folk - and will be ignored in elections.

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Anonymous said...

Anyone using the term 'Socialism' as a blanket pejorative is a fucking idiot if they live in the UK. Almost all of the population have benefited from a pragmatic mix of socialist institutions and policies balanced against other attitudes and methods of providing services. Unless you were taken to America for your jabs when you were a baby and all subsequent healthcare, or have exclusively had private, non-subsidised schooling and healthcare you're not in a position to try and pretend "Socialism" is a dirty word without being guilty of legendary levels of hypocrisy.

If you are in that position - you're lucky enough to have been born stupendously rich but are lacking in any kind of empathy for those of us not independently wealthy and you're really not qualified to have an opinion on what socialist elements are REQUIRED for the quality of life in the UK to be any good for the majority of people. If you're rich enough to not need the NHS to remain costless and you're willing to see the USA levels of penury inflicted on someone who gets hit by a car on their way to work, or is genetically unlucky in some way - you're exactly the kind of person who shouldn't be making decisions on the NHS.

Fuck off back to America with all this "Socialism is the ultimate evil" monosyllabic thinking. MORE nuance is needed in the UK for us to benefit, not less. The one thing that any thinking person can state confidently is that wherever political tribalism has resulted in all conversations being a binary mud-slinging exercises : no one but the incredibly rich and powerful on either side of the agenda have benefited.

Just the 0.02 from a prole who is fed up of antagonistic, American counter-intellectual imports to the British political conversation. Keep your fucking hands off our NHS and other key institutions and don't be a plebeian mouthpiece for your 'betters' who want to turn it into a moneyspinner. Your descendants will be the ones consigned to misery unless you're very rich or very lucky.

Anonymous said...

Corbyn was rejected for several reasons. The Labour policy on Brexit was certainly the catalyst, despite stating that they would "respect the vote" etc in their 17 manifesto the policy was overturned to become new deal Vs remain. Having another referendum without implementing the first one is plainly anti-democratic and, I believe, not something that Corbyn was behind. This was pushed heavily by Keir Starmer and others who forced it upon the party. Because of this Boris' campaign of 'Get Brexit Done' and 'Lend us your vote' worked well, although not AS well as it would appear. That's where the last two things come into play. Those who couldn't stomach voting Tory WERE able to vote for the Brexit Party (far right Tories by any other name) and therefore split the vote letting Tories in the back door in many of the heartlands. But the REAL overriding reason was the FOUR YEARS of smears and lies and attempts to oust Corbyn by those in the PLP. The MPs openly briefing against their leader and organising the smears. ONLY a smear campaign organised from within the party could have been so successful. Starmer's barely concealed glee when interviewed was sickening. I fear the party will now lurch to the right again and away from it's own members and voters. Far from making the argument for progressive socialism because it is right they will 'focus group' whatever they think is popular and adopt it as policy instead.

the blame for this result lies at the feet of people like Kier Starmer, Jess Phillips, Ruth Smeath, Wes Street to name but a few. They have spent SO long belittling Corbyn publicly and now they seem surprised that they've had a humiliating result.

The 'period of reflection' as it's being called, will only involve the PLP blaming Corbyn, no lessons will be learned from this. They don't realise they have caused their party possible irreparable damage. I'm not overstating this. Look what's happened in Scotland, time after time in GEs Labour is in the minority with only ONE Labour MP out of 59 now. That's not just because SNP are popular, that's because in the run up to the 2014 referendum when the Scottish Labour Party had come up with counter proposals to independence, a two year project of policies to offer as an alternative, Milliband tore up their work and what was eventually published was 20 pages long, mostly filler, and looked like a kid who'd done their homework assignment on the last possible night and hadn't even stayed up late to finish it. It was an embarrassment and the Scottish Labour Party knew THEY were being ignored never mind the voters who had been loyal for decades. Add to this the joint campaign with the Scottish Conservatives and the APPALLING behaviour of Alistair Darling and his cohorts in the name of Labour and you have an entire country that will never trust Labour again.

In the North of England we see history repeating itself. They voted overwhelmingly to Leave and were promised their vote would be respected only to discover they'd been double crossed. Now the double crossers are about to take full control and think they'll win back support? They look out the window in their London homes and think they know what the rest of the country thinks because of it, they have no idea...

Ian Delaney said...

I think one has to see the bigger picture when it comes to doing a post-election analysis of gains and losses. Certainly, the issue over Brexit and Corbyn's unpopularity were significant factors but Labour's demise has been a gradual process going back to the last term of their time in office 2005-10. Blair left the party with a huge credibility problem, which none of his successors were fully able to resolve. Brown carried on with the same policies when he could have turned the party around, and Miliband was unable to offer any radical alternative to the coalition austerity agenda. Corbyn seems to be the end product of a party that has lost touch with its grass roots.

Stephen Tunmore said...

I am in polite postal discussion with my local, tory, MP. I sent him a list of achievements by the tory Government, (homelessness, education, NHS privatisation etc etc) Amazingling he sent me a reply! While ignoring the effects of tory policy on the people of this country. He highlighted,
1...the last Labour Govt borrowing 1 in 4 pounds it was spending
2...that financial situation being unsustainable,
3...financial stabilisation being required to stop other contries losing faith in us,
4...they created effective full employmemt,
5...they have improved school result as shown by international literacy rates
6...they have focussed higher funding on the most disadvantaged
I would like some recommendations of reliable references to refute these comments in my reply to him. I have some but would like some help. I can also be e mailled on stephen.tunmore@hotmail.co.uk.

Anonymous said...

Corbyn has done more for the Tories than any other Labour leader, he gave them an 80 seat majority he best Christmas present ever and by the looks of it they will be in power for many years to come, WORST RESULT IN SCOTLAND SINCE 1910, WORST RESULT IN REST OF UK SINCE 1935
ns clown Corbyn says we won the argument.

deepak said...




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Anonymous said...

If you're a white, Northern, Working class person who reads the Labour manifesto and gets to the "Green Industrial Revolution" chapter and reads that the 400 billion invested in it alongside new legislation to ensure that a quarter of apprenticeships will have to be directed toward green energy and that those apprenticeships will heavily favour BAME people (i.e. non whites). Has anyone twigged here that a) Those voters are going to rightly click that that's racist and b) it's a racist policy that doesn't favour them because they were born white.

Obviously I'm expecting cries of: The Tories are Islamophobic or have anti-Semitic members in their ranks, or that right wingers are racist in general etc... But so is the Labour manifesto. On top of that; race quota's have never been proven to improve the standard of living of any country they've been implemented in.

So you've got a racist manifesto pledge that has no evidence behind it to prove that it's going to improve the lives of those in the UK.

What a massive self own by Labour.

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous

"Anyone using the term 'Socialism' as a blanket pejorative is a fucking idiot if they live in the UK. Almost all of the population have benefited from a pragmatic mix of socialist institutions and policies balanced against other attitudes and methods of providing services."

No they haven't. The literal definition of Socialism is seizing the means of production and re-distributing it either through nationalisation or co-operatives. This Ideology saw the Winter of Discontent, power cuts and services closing down throughout the country in the late seventies and two enormous bailouts from the IMF. Stating that the NHS is socialist is a misnomer. Socialism is a continued attack up capitalism and the excesses had to be purged by the Tory government when they failed. My God, you're aware that Coal mining when state owned was so backward, miners were still using pick axes into the sixties right? Read basic definitions and UK economic history.

Anonymous said...

"Unless you were taken to America for your jabs when you were a baby and all subsequent healthcare, or have exclusively had private, non-subsidised schooling and healthcare you're not in a position to try and pretend "Socialism" is a dirty word without being guilty of legendary levels of hypocrisy.""

I'm assuming you think American healthcare past the nineteen sixties is free market? Have you even bothered to look into the medicare legislation from then that's allowed Big Pharma to specifically write legislation favouring it as a monopoly? U.S healthcare is fucked because of nationalisation attempts. Read American economic history.

"If you are in that position - you're lucky enough to have been born stupendously rich but are lacking in any kind of empathy for those of us not independently wealthy and you're really not qualified to have an opinion on what socialist elements are REQUIRED for the quality of life in the UK to be any good for the majority of people."

You've already shown your ignorance of basic economic history and fact. You certainly don't sound qualified, just angry and with a very simplistic worldview.

"If you're rich enough to not need the NHS to remain costless and you're willing to see the USA levels of penury inflicted on someone who gets hit by a car on their way to work, or is genetically unlucky in some way - you're exactly the kind of person who shouldn't be making decisions on the NHS."

Hmm, ok: Please explain corporate contracts for medical instruments on a nationalised system and their systemic inequality of innovation? Please explain the bidding system the NHS utilises for medication? Please explain the specifics of how the NHS is run, it's comparisons to the U.S system on any level and how you would go about innovating change in it to better people's lives... Obviously as immigration is a hot topic; you're going to provide a balanced and non racist, fully fact checked list of the NHS expenditure in this area?

Or are you just going to get your knickers in a twist that you lost the election and tell people they're not allowed to talk about the health service the Government forces them to pay for?

"Fuck off back to America with all this "Socialism is the ultimate evil" monosyllabic thinking."

I'm not from America, but in reply to your insult (as you've lowered the bar): Your mother's a cunt whore.

"MORE nuance is needed in the UK for us to benefit, not less."
Lol, then provide some. Preferably with citation dickhead.

"The one thing that any thinking person can state confidently is that wherever political tribalism has resulted in all conversations being a binary mud-slinging exercises : no one but the incredibly rich and powerful on either side of the agenda have benefited."

Well done, you've lowered the bar by insulting everyone who disagrees with racism and then said the rich benefit. By your own admission you've owned yourself.

Dude, sort your life out.

Anonymous said...

Lol, Socialism, not racism.

I awaited a well researched, well cited response comparing both healthcare systems. Go on, you can do it.

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Anonymous said...

You were jealous we were the only ones with a fat blond nutjob private state commie with npd in charge here in America. Keeping up with the jones' nation style.

Anonymous said...

2017,the late genius Stephen Hawking said Jeremy Corbyn should resign as Labour leader, adding that although he believes in many of his policies, he cannot win a general election.
“I regard Corbyn as a disaster,” the renowned physicist told the Times. “His heart is in the right place and many of his policies are sound, but he has allowed himself to be portrayed as a leftwing extremist,” Hawking said he would still vote Labour but did not believe the party would win at the next general election. “I think he should step down for the sake of the party,” he said. He has been proved 100% correct.

Anonymous said...

Of the 52 seats the Conservatives took from Labour, 52 of them voted for Brexit in 2016. Corbyn's Labour was committed to honouring the result of the referendum when it fought the election in 2017. Labour won the highest vote share since 2001 and gained seats for the first time since 1997. With the same policies, but compromised by the right wing of his party into betraying the referendum result instead of honouring it by guaranteeing it, the party put in its worst performance in many decades. You don't have to be a brain surgeon to work out that it was Labour's Brexit policy, initially foisted on it by people who would certainly prefer to see Johnson in power rather than Corbyn - by the rump of Blair's PLP - which lost us this election. You do have to be extremely blinkered or terminally stupid to come to any other conclusion. Thanks to Remainers, we got Johnson's Brexit rather than Corbyn's. Thanks a bunch. Learn this: betraying the result of a referendum is a red rag to any electorate, and tantamount to political suicide. You've just seen that demonstrated beyond any reasonable doubt.

Anonymous said...

I think you are too smart. I personally strongly believe it has everything to do with the sounds of words and the beat of the sound bite. It is 100% irrelevant what they were saying (as this article pretty much proves neatly) .

Speaking to my right wing, daily mail reading parents; Corbyns policy was "let me be clear" or "can you let me finish". Mum....that isn't a policy. "Thats what i remember him saying all the time". The average voter is so apathetic to the system they switched off on word number 5. Same for my nan, my dad, and 3 other relative examples. These are not dense people just busy busy who are fully plugged in to the mainstream media outlets. The media didnt promote policy therefore your average voter knew NONE of the above.

Meanwhile on the counter side there were two major catchphrases. "Get brexit done". Not a policy. But inspired hope, meant change,and was only 3 words so all would hear it. And no one could bother to listen to a long explanation of why it is simply a lie. Finally "anti semitic marxist Corbyn" was pretty much how he was always referred to. Its hard wired in us to dislike the "s" sound; think semantics. Snakes, sinister; negative negative connotations. And when i heard right wingers say it i asked their opinion of Karl and they were clueless as to what i meant. So they use words people dont understand that conjured negative connotations. Multiple this by two years of repetition and you have a brainwashed population thanks to a watering down of education causing a lack of critical thinking and a lack of time to research truth due to endless media propaganda.

So as much as i love this and all your articles you need take a deep breathe and realise you live on an island of people not as a) engaged b) interested c) smart as you.

If Labour want to win they need a maximum 4 word sound bite that appeals to the nation. Not deep thought out ideas that Corbyn had that need to be discussed. Just look at 1997.
Education, education, education.

Simple to remember! To the point. Passionate. The whole issue of this election; people over estimated the intelligence of the populous.

I dont like what i am saying; but its the sad truth of the modern world in my opinion.

Unknown said...

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Anonymous said...

Yes, it's no surprise that Labour lost out in the GE. Although a landslide the vote share was still very respectable, Labour governments have won with less. But, by going back on their initial Brexit policy (ie 'Respecting the Vote' Vs Second Referendum')and not publicising what their version of Brexit was (properly, I mean)they pushed their own Leave voters away, this coincided with The Brexit Party forming and, cleverly, deciding NOT to have themselves a 'right wing' manifesto, therefore removing guilt from former Labour voters. Johnson's campaign cleverly used the 'lend us your vote' tag to their 'Get Brexit Done' slogan and hovered up a few disgruntled Labour votes too.

Still, none of that would have been quite enough to give the result we saw. I admit that splitting the Labour vote with the Brexit Party DID 'let the Tories in the back door' but this still couldn't have happened without the 'Corbyn Factor'

Since elected, Corbyn has stirred up much raw emotion, mostly in the Labour Party. Those who voted for him loved him, truly. He was, and still is, the embodiment of Labour vslues, democratic and truly about the many, not the few. Obviously this went down extremely badly and they tried to oust him (PLP) When unsuccessful they embarked on the longest, dirtiest smear campaign I have EVER seen. Because the smears we have seen (aside from the election campaign posters)have come from within. Corbyn is NOT a terrorist sympathiser nor an anti-Semite, he is most definitely NOT on the 'hard left' either. Corbyn is a Labour moderate.

It was the PLP and friends who have taken a popular leader who did better than expected against May and made him (personally) the reason that many wouldn't vote Labour. They spent years concocting smears and doctoring information before disseminating it to newspapers, television and right-wing blogs. This happened on an almost daily basis. Protests were organised by small numbers of people and given MASSIVE coverage by BBC and ITV. Remember, the BBC just doesn't COVER protests anymore, there must have been a special meeting about this. Since the infamous 'kettling' death of a newspaper vendor in London, nothing is televised or much spoken of anymore unless, of course, it happens overseas.

So there will be much celebration that Corbyn has resigned in some circles of the Labour Party, but the cost of that was giving away this election and allowing the Tories to negotiate Brexit and at least 5 years of increasingly severe punishment of the disabled, elderly and poor.

I sincerely hope that Kier Starmer is NOT the next leader, nor Jess Phillips. They, and others, conspired to cause the circumstances wee see today, a battered and broken party unable to protect us from Tory excesses at a time we need that protection most. If either of them get their hands on the Labour Party it will be such in name only...

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Anonymous said...

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